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      *** Voting for the MeFiCoFo Board has begun! ***
      September General Site Update | 9/27 MeFiCoFo Board Update

      The Invasion of Chicago
      October 2, 2025 7:21 AM   Subscribe

      Early on the morning of October 1st, federal agents with Border Patrol, the FBI and the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives raided an entire apartment building at 7500 S. South Shore Drive, knocking down doors and dragging men, women and children from their apartments: My building is shaking. So, I'm like, 'What is that?' Then I look out the window, it's a Blackhawk helicopter," said witness Dr. Alii Muhammad.

      Now, Trump has raised the stakes for Chicago during a meeting with military leaders and Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth. The president called Chicago an unsafe place that he plans to straighten out.

      "And this is going to be a major part for some of the people in this room. That's a war, too. It's a war from within. I told Pete, we should use some of these dangerous cities as training grounds for our military," Trump said.


      ***
      Szymanski said federal agents also cut the building¡¯s exterior power. On Tuesday, he saw multiple windows broken on every story.

      ¡°They tore the whole building apart,¡± Szymanski said.
      posted by oneirodynia (159 comments total) 16 users marked this as a favorite
       
      .
      posted by crazy_yeti at 7:33 AM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      .
      posted by Peach at 7:34 AM on October 2


      It's fucking horrible. People being grabbed everywhere. I feel so sick and powerless.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 7:35 AM on October 2 [9 favorites]


      FAA has shut down the Chicago airspace to drones: https://tfr.faa.gov/tfr3/?page=detail_5_3678.

      Very normal.
      posted by zenon at 7:35 AM on October 2 [5 favorites]


      Definitely keep flying drones, people.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 7:36 AM on October 2 [8 favorites]


      .
      posted by lalochezia at 7:37 AM on October 2


      ¡°I asked [agents] why they were holding me if I was an American citizen, and they said I had to wait until they looked me up,¡± Jones said. ¡°I asked if they had a warrant, and I asked for a lawyer. They never brought one.¡±

      Warrant-less federal agents ransacked an apartment building in the night and carried away an unknown number of people.

      This is happening.
      posted by neuracnu at 7:39 AM on October 2 [56 favorites]


      It's fucking enervating that this administration fucking says "Here is the kind of terrible stuff we will be doing," we fucking say, "This terrible shit is coming," people scold us as fucking doomers, the feds do the fucking terrible things they said and we said they would do, and even fucking so, the very next time we open our mouths and say, "They have said they are about to do [particular kind of terrible shit] and that is what we should expect" the goalposts will just be moved so that we can be scolded as doomers all over again.
      posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:42 AM on October 2 [69 favorites]


      Fuck. This is insane.
      posted by Faintdreams at 7:43 AM on October 2 [7 favorites]


      Huh? Our governor has been fighting HARD for Illinois, that doesn't apply here.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 7:46 AM on October 2 [14 favorites]


      Huh? Our governor has been fighting HARD for Illinois, that doesn't apply here.

      He's literally watching his city be invaded and brutalized by a hostile power. What liberals have been browbeaten into accepting as "fighting" is not fighting. Not any more. Fighting is fighting.
      posted by aintnolobos at 7:49 AM on October 2 [11 favorites]


      Chicago is not "the governor's city" and you don't seem to know what he's been saying and doing lately, and have a vague point about "liberals" so my point stands.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 7:50 AM on October 2 [11 favorites]


      Chicago is not "the governor's city"

      Does he or does he not represent his constituents, and do his constituents want the federal government to continue to terrorize their city?
      posted by aintnolobos at 7:52 AM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      Hon. Seriously.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 7:52 AM on October 2 [6 favorites]


      aintnolobos - what PRECISELY would you want the governor to do in this situation, and on what timescale? In detail?
      posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:53 AM on October 2 [6 favorites]


      What the fuck do you think the governor can do?
      posted by Thorzdad at 7:54 AM on October 2 [3 favorites]


      Hon. Seriously.

      A blackhawk helicopter landed on the roof of a random apartment building in Chicago and regime goons raided door to door arresting everyone for being poor and brown. This is serious. Treat it seriously.
      posted by aintnolobos at 7:54 AM on October 2 [6 favorites]


      I mean if you live here I'm willing to listen to criticism that's pointed, not vague. Otherwise
      posted by tiny frying pan at 7:56 AM on October 2 [4 favorites]


      I'm not the one treating this unseriously. You have a lot of nerve acting like I'm being frivolous about this. Look at my first comment. You are being a troll, I'm done with you.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 7:57 AM on October 2 [9 favorites]


      Governor Pritzker simply needs to authorize our state military to fight against the federal agents. This is so obvious. Just call the state of Illinois' own military force into actio--
      posted by phunniemee at 7:57 AM on October 2 [10 favorites]


      What the fuck do you think the governor can do?

      Eminent domain on all Trump-owned properties in the state.
      posted by mittens at 7:58 AM on October 2 [28 favorites]


      I'm finding myself in an uncomfortable gray area where I do not at all think it is reasonable to talk about secession or demand that governors combat feds as a hostile outside force and yet, the idea that we should be appeased if Pritzker files some paperwork or makes a sharply-worded speech about this makes me want to pull my fucking hair out.

      I do not have an answer for what option should be pulled from this basically uncharted mess in the middle.

      I do not.
      posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:59 AM on October 2 [38 favorites]


      I want him to keep posting on social media and quipping to cameras while his constituents are brutalized without recourse, because I'm a reasonable, pragmatic, and very smart person.

      We made an effort to ask you SERIOUSLY what you expected the governor to do, and gave you an opportunity to seriously state your own expectations. You instead chose to continue to make sarcastic potshots about how he wasn't doing things to your (as yet undefined) specifications.

      You are not helping solve the problem.

      We want you to PONY THE FUCK UP.
      posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:01 AM on October 2 [9 favorites]


      I haven't been over to Kenwood in a minute. Are the guys with uzis still in front of Farrakhan's house? Maybe Pritzker can call them.
      posted by phunniemee at 8:01 AM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      I really need, for my sanity, for there to be an option between "welp, we revolution now" and "let's continue to work the levers of this transparently broken/rigged system."

      I do not know what that option would be, but I will tell you that the "You're going to hear from our lawyers about this!" side is starting to sound nearly as delusional as the "Now we declare war" side and I do not like this at all.
      posted by DirtyOldTown at 8:03 AM on October 2 [45 favorites]


      It is definitely a reasonable to be thinking about what kind of responses in force a governor ought to be making when the citizens of his state are abducted without due process and paramilitary forces are violating the rights and property of those citizens.

      Anyone with any power has an obligation to push back against this, and if they aren¡¯t, I¡¯m assuming it¡¯s a tacit granting of permission.
      posted by Jon_Evil at 8:05 AM on October 2 [8 favorites]


      Neighbors like Eboni Watson say they ducked for cover as they heard several flash bangs.

      "They was terrified. The kids was crying. People was screaming. They looked very distraught. I was out there crying when I seen the little girl come around the corner, because they was bringing the kids down, too, had them zip tied to each other," Watson said. "That's all I kept asking. What is the morality? Where's the human? One of them literally laughed. He was standing right here. He said, 'f*** them kids.'"
      There need to be repercussions.
      posted by postcommunism at 8:05 AM on October 2 [30 favorites]


      There really isn¡¯t anything a governor can do. Zero. The only force a governor might technically have is the national guard, but Trump has already usurped that authority. And, to be blunt, Trump wants an armed resistance, so that he can wage complete war against america.
      posted by Thorzdad at 8:07 AM on October 2 [8 favorites]


      One thing blue cities and states could do is monkey wrenching: is there an ICE field office in your jurisdiction? Time for endless roadwork around it.
      posted by jedicus at 8:08 AM on October 2 [37 favorites]


      Funny how the government is shut down and it¡¯s the Democrats fault, except of course for the fascist parts, which are somehow still incredibly functional. This is shocking and terrifying on a level I didn¡¯t think I would get to by September. And living in one of these blue cities, now that effectively all of the budget is going to ICE, I fully expect to see this escalate in blue cities across the country. And like others, I don¡¯t know what to do. We were told ICE couldn¡¯t enter a building without a warrant. And they are making clear that they don¡¯t care and it doesn¡¯t matter. Would the news even report on a blood bath at this point?
      posted by UltraMorgnus at 8:08 AM on October 2 [8 favorites]


      I'm hoping that those of you talking about actually fighting are not going to be actually fighting; if you are going to do direct action that will definitely be seen as criminal, don't talk about it on the internet. Don't talk about it at all, ideally. Get away with it, instead.
      posted by surlyben at 8:09 AM on October 2 [8 favorites]


      I am not a state governor or a city mayor. I never endeavored to be one. As such, I am not aware of the tools or resources at a mayor or governor's disposal when faced with a federal government that is violating the Constitution within the boundaries I was sworn to protect. I do, however, presume that they are greater than my own means, or the means of any regular person posting comments on the internet.

      It's a bit silly to demand people without the means of elected officials in power to dream up a local defense strategy.
      posted by neuracnu at 8:09 AM on October 2 [4 favorites]


      So instead you are going to keep cracking snide jokes on social media and quipping to cameras while your fellow citizens are brutalized without recourse, and you'll continue to tell yourself you're a reasonable, pragmatic, and very smart person.

      It is difficult sometimes to get liberals to understand that the governor of the state of illinois has more power than some fuckin goober posting "blue states have no recourse but real resistance."
      posted by aintnolobos at 8:09 AM on October 2 [3 favorites]


      Check the zoning for every ICE/CBP/FBI/Trump-owned building and every building and house owned by his cabinet members and advisors. Do building code inspections. Hassle them and vigorously pursue any violations. State tax audits. Everything.

      Unfortunately, and this is itself very telling, what states and cities can¡¯t do is rely on any action that requires non-trivial police support.
      posted by jedicus at 8:12 AM on October 2 [21 favorites]


      aintnolobos: "4,000 FBI officers were recently reassigned to tracking anyone espousing pro-LGBT or anti-capitalist beliefs for terrorist pre-crime. You get put on a list for saying trans women are women now; if you think I'm going to talk specifics for the American Troubles here then you will be disappointed."

      Hi it's the Governor of Illinois doing a thing.
      posted by phunniemee at 8:12 AM on October 2 [9 favorites]


      > It's up to the people with all the power and money to decide whether there will be a third option. Until then: choose.

      My dude you are exercising the impotence of a pseudonymous account on a minor text-based forum. If the matter is of urgency to you I encourage you to make a greater effort in the world at large rather than pissing off people who were probably politically reasonably well aligned with you.
      posted by at by at 8:12 AM on October 2 [20 favorites]


      This is from someone who is scared to say trans women are women and trans men are men on the internet, even tho they are that, but go ahead and take advice from them y'all we just don't understand that there is unexplained governor power to stop all this
      posted by tiny frying pan at 8:13 AM on October 2 [2 favorites]


      I wanna remind us that making us feel terrified and panicked and stressed and lashing out at one another is part of the political goals of this kind of terror.
      posted by Jon_Evil at 8:17 AM on October 2 [59 favorites]


      It is potentially life-saving, so yeah, it is neat!

      Can the rest of us please get back to serious discussion and ignore the trolling? This Chicagoan would really appreciate it.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 8:17 AM on October 2 [10 favorites]


      ¡°An FBI Counterterrorism Vet Explains How To Use Trump's New Orders Against The Left,¡± Spencer Ackerman, FOREVER WARS, 30 September 2025 [Crossposted]
      posted by ob1quixote at 8:20 AM on October 2 [5 favorites]


      Acts of war against the american people will continue and only escalate until blue state governors are willing to risk violence to stop it. They won't do that, though, because they are not fundamentally opposed to a reign of terror against the poor and powerless.

      Okay, I believe this. BUT making it happen is a long slog and you can't draw back your hand once you start. How is Pritzger going to call people up and who is he going to call up? How will he arm them? How will he pay them? How will they be trained?

      It won't be the cops, the most heavily armed force in most states. If actual federal troops roll in, the cops will be on their side, just like they're on ICE's side.

      Like, you are de facto talking about building to building fighting. You are talking about the people of Chicago going against a much better armed force. You are talking about people going out there knowing they will be shot and sometimes killed.

      And remember what was done to MOVE (by the police). If the feds start dropping munitions on American cities, there's no amount of heroic state level resistance that will be able to deal with that, and there's absolutely nothing that leads me to believe they won't. The Trump administration would absolutely bomb American civilians and then post memes about it.

      I think Pritzger is a good guy and I honestly think that if there's a major politician in the US who would be at least somewhat willing to think through these questions, it's him. At the same time, these are really tough questions and I don't fault any governor for hesitating under current conditions.

      As DOT says, this has been a long, long time coming. The points where it could easily be stopped by state level resistance have long been passed. The can got kicked down the road until it got kicked over a cliff.

      ~~
      I'd expect escalating autonomous resistance. How much it escalates depends on how much Trump escalates.
      posted by Frowner at 8:21 AM on October 2 [31 favorites]


      Aaron Reichlin-Melnick, of the American Immigration Council, about if Illinois can do anything:

      Hard to say. Not sure Illinois has the ability to do anything. There may be a civil rights lawsuit seeking to stop warrantless arrests, as there has been in Chicago, but since the Supreme Court let the LA injunction lift DHS is massively emboldened. And the shutdown is another lawsuit complication.
      posted by MisantropicPainforest at 8:21 AM on October 2 [4 favorites]


      Tiny frying pan - the link to the legal hotline above looks like it's about a more general line for LGBTQ+ residents facing less immediate issues. You've said you're in Chicago - if you hear of any similar action or have ideas for how those outside Chicago can support, can you share?
      posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:21 AM on October 2


      I want to know why this isn't front-page news everywhere.

      I am limiting my news intake, but I still skim headlines, and I had not heard about this at all until I saw this thread.

      This is utterly appalling.

      I was struck by this:
      Jones, who lives on the fourth floor, said most of his neighbors were Venezuelan and often took turns cleaning the hallway because the property owners did little to maintain it.

      ¡°They were cool people,¡± Jones said as he looked into his next door neighbor¡¯s unit. ¡°They didn¡¯t speak a lick of English, but we used translator apps to talk to each other.¡±
      I always think of translator apps as being used by privileged tourists somewhere. In the midst of this horror, it was a glint of encouragement to me to read about someone doing his best to connect and communicate with his neighbors.


      I don't know what to do or say about this, other than to keep trying to send whatever encouragement and money I can scrounge to whichever government officials and immigrant justice organizations I can find that are trying to fight back. There is a small part of my heart that hopes that atrocities like this will move even more people to protest and push back, that the people least connected to the news cycle will see the ever-growing evidence that these raids have nothing to do with deporting criminals and everything to do with naked racist brutality; a part of me that hopes that these violent assaults on our neighbors will awaken enough outrage to make embracing hatred unthinkable.

      But it can't outrage us if we don't even hear about it.

      Thank you so much for posting this, oneirodynia. I am furious and heartbroken, but I'm glad you shared this, because I needed to know.
      posted by kristi at 8:22 AM on October 2 [25 favorites]


      > One thing blue cities and states could do is monkey wrenching: is there an ICE field office in your jurisdiction? Time for endless roadwork around it.

      Guerrilla bureaucracy? Hell yeah, jam the gears with everything they throw at us.
      posted by Godspeed.You!Black.Emperor.Penguin at 8:26 AM on October 2 [8 favorites]


      First Defense Legal Aid: 1-800-LAW-REP4 - for those who have had rights violated by police. Don't know what they're doing on the ground but it's a good resource regardless.

      I'm sure there are better things to post, will look for more resources.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 8:32 AM on October 2 [3 favorites]


      is there an ICE field office in your jurisdiction? Time for endless roadwork around it.

      Can't say it's related at all, but the arterial streets leading into my 90%++ Mexican neighborhood have been tore up to diverted single stream traffic for the last 2ish weeks, ever since the quietest independence day weekend I've experienced living here. Bigass Brandon Johnson Build Better Together signs capping every traffic barricade.
      posted by phunniemee at 8:34 AM on October 2 [9 favorites]


      The People's Patrol in the suburbs are doing good work. Saw that a little library owner in Chicago pivoted to flyers attached to whistles to alert neighbor of ICE presence (and annoy ICE). We're at sticks and rocks level against the feds and the feds know it. There is no armed resistance against the federal government, conservative fantasy is just that, we cannot stop this on the ground. It's terrifying.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 8:38 AM on October 2 [4 favorites]


      I'm sitting with jedicus's ideas about how municipal resources could be used to create literal roadblocks to ICE and I think these are thoughts in the right direction. I hope Pritzker has people looking to exploit his tools in sideways fashion like this.
      posted by DirtyOldTown at 8:39 AM on October 2 [12 favorites]


      Chicago area Mefite meetup at the Broadview ICE facility? What if everyone in the Chicagoland area made the neighborhoods around the ICE facility as crowded as downtown at rush hour?
      posted by Reverend John at 8:51 AM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      It's extremely important in times like this to make a distinction between people actively supporting it and people "not doing enough" to stop it.

      Identify the active, vocal supporters of this bullshit. Gather and keep your evidence. When and if the time comes for De-MAGA-fication of the US, let's make sure these people are ostracized completely, never put into a position of authority over another human being, and if they're the masked goons themselves, prosecuted and punished for their crimes.

      If you think Pritzker isn't doing enough and that attacking the goons is the way to proceed, go do what you think is right. Be the change you want to see in the world. Right now, as bad as it is, I'm not interested in a hot civil war. It may be coming, but I'm not inclined to hasten its arrival.
      posted by tclark at 8:55 AM on October 2 [8 favorites]


      Candidate for the 9th Congressional District, ?Kat Abughazaleh?, will be holding a press conference at the Broadview ICE facility tomorrow at 9am, 1930 Beach St., Broadview.
      posted by Reverend John at 8:58 AM on October 2 [12 favorites]


      I saw a claim (I think on Reddit) that Portland has various restrictions on ICE facilities and has threatened to shut them down for violations. I don't know if that's true, but I would not be surprised if jedicus's suggestions resulted in the appearance of federal troops, similar to what's happening in Portland.
      posted by elizabot at 9:01 AM on October 2 [5 favorites]


      I'm an Illinoisan and a Chicago-area person and I'm not mad at Pritzker, who is definitely not being passive.

      However, I would really like to see him expand his toolkit.

      No, it's not fucking time to start a civil war. But this is not a "strongly worded clapback" situation or even a "We'll see what the courts say" situation and to think so would be nearly as wrongheaded.
      posted by DirtyOldTown at 9:04 AM on October 2 [14 favorites]


      I heard that fire departments have demanded fence removal at some facilities as violation of fire code, I am all for local municipal obstruction and agitation.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 9:05 AM on October 2 [19 favorites]


      But this is not a "strongly worded clapback" situation or even a "We'll see what the courts say" situation and to think so would be nearly as wrongheaded.

      The problem is that stochastic resistance to stochastic terrorism is going to be hard to identify. Anyone making a big show about the hassles and trouble they're making for the regime's goons is going to undermine the utility of it. It's the fog of cold war, and I'm not sure what the right answer is, either.
      posted by tclark at 9:08 AM on October 2 [4 favorites]


      If you are asking people to detail their hot actions in this thread you are effectively a fed.

      Also fun to see that this speedrun is at the "post cyrillic at people with differing views" mile marker. And by fun how about knock it off.
      posted by Slackermagee at 9:10 AM on October 2 [7 favorites]


      Thanks for highlighting this ¨C when I read the Tribune article, I printed it out as the most clear and shocking evidence of the complete collapse of the rule of law in the United States.
      posted by reedbird_hill at 9:11 AM on October 2 [4 favorites]


      How Chicago is resisting Donald Trump¡¯s immigration crackdown [The Guardian | video]
      posted by mazola at 9:13 AM on October 2 [4 favorites]


      Flagged a swath of comments. Piling onto someone who a bunch of you have arbitrarily decided is a troll (in Russian, no less, or curses) just because that person doesn't want to add comments to a public post with their suggestions for how to respond to federal armed forces, among other bad-faith readings of what they actually said, is not useful or the kind of thing we should be doing here. It seems like people might be doing that because that commenter had some vague critical things to say about "liberals" this or that. Sure, specific suggestions might be more useful than vague critiques are, but it's probably good to remember that someone might have apprehensions or criticisms about the efficacy of liberal leaders' approach to dealing with a situation like this¡ªor about what might safely be posted about it¡ªand still not actually be, like, your enemy.

      As others have noted, one of the big reasons we have governments is so they deal with things like this on our behalf, rather than people deputizing themselves the militia and deciding to take some kind of action on their own. I understand that that might not be working great at the moment¡ªor at least we don't yet know all of the options there might be to address what's happening¡ªbut demanding that people pony up some kind of hot plans here, and refusing to accept any replies that don't provide that, is itself trolling, counterproductive, and weirdly hawkish.

      What federal agents are doing is horrifying, and as DirtyOldTown noted, I sincerely, agonizingly hope state and local government can respond in a way that threads the needle between escalating armed confrontation and simply filing paperwork and making snarky remarks on social media.
      posted by limeonaire at 9:14 AM on October 2 [12 favorites]


      If you are asking people to detail their hot actions in this thread you are effectively a fed.

      And if you are dropping mouse turds about how Prtitzker isn't "doing enough" but you fail to clarify what "enough" would BE you are either a troll, or you are a six-year-old having a tantrum because you think governors should be able to just manifest ICE out of their states instantaneously like Thanos.
      posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:17 AM on October 2 [9 favorites]


      It really disturbs me that we have a "government shutdown" that doesn't include the stuff Republicans care about.

      ICE is still getting paid and still terrorizing the general public, but we can't go to a national park, how the fuck does that make sense and who wrote the rules so that during a "government shutown" only the shit we care about is stopped while every one of the Republican parts of government is operating at what looks like full capicity and without any problems?

      Much as I favor the D's finally finding their spine, I can't help but notice that the one action they did have available to impede Trump doesn't seem to have done much beyond stop the few remaining good parts of the govenrment from functioning while leaving the evil parts working just fine.


      More generally, as far as resistence goes, I think the local city governments are impeded by two things, first being a reluctance to actually take steps that are unequivicobly against Trump/ICE/DHS/whatever by (for example) tearing out the roads around all of their buildings or whatever, and second by the part where their own pigs are all in on Trump and will actively work for Trump and against the city government.

      if the mayor of Chicago did start trying to tear out roads around DHS and ICE buildings, the Chicago police would stop it from happening, and probably arrest the mayor for good measure.

      Not to say they shouldn't TRY, but...

      One possible thought? And it's dangerous, risky, likely not legally workable, and would be an escalation to physical force?

      A city law stating that any person with their face covered and/or not displaying a badge with their name and ID number is, legally speaking, NOT law enforcement and it is the right and duty of people to physically oppose those not law enforcement people if they try to kidnap anyone or otherwise pretend to carry out law enforcement actions.

      Any mask wearing person claiming to be ICE, by city law, is by definition not ICE and no citizen can be arrested, fined, procecuted, or otherwise messed with if they impede the fuck out of the masked criminals falsely claiming to be ICE.

      It probably wouldn't work.

      But it's better than a law saying they can't cover their faces, becuase they'll just break that law. A law saying people with face coverings are instantly and automatically not granted any of the usual law enforcement powers, respect, legal cover, amplified charges for impeding, etc is self enforcing. Or it would be until the Supreme Court said it wasn't legal, but maybe we could get a couple days of work out of it.


      Jon_Evil While I agree about the fear being a deliberate part of what they're doing, frankly at this juncture anger and fear seem like the proper emotions to feel.
      posted by sotonohito at 9:19 AM on October 2 [15 favorites]


      At this point, the only thing that is going to turn the screws is an extremely large scale, extended and distributed, leaderless refusal to put money into the system. We need to use our collective ability to cause the rich real economic pain, and to frighten them in the process.
      posted by reedbird_hill at 9:21 AM on October 2 [7 favorites]


      if the mayor of Chicago did start trying to tear out roads around DHS and ICE buildings, the Chicago police would stop it from happening, and probably arrest the mayor for good measure.

      I sincerely doubt that. Chicago police are notorious but they have a working relationship with our mayor. They are not wholeheartedly assisting ICE.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 9:25 AM on October 2 [2 favorites]


      At this point, the only thing that is going to turn the screws is an extremely large scale, extended and distributed, leaderless refusal to put money into the system.

      It's going to be very interesting in the context of a government shutdown to see how these ICE soldiers keep up the bad fight without any fucking pay.
      posted by sciatrix at 9:25 AM on October 2 [6 favorites]


      Mod note: A few comments deleted. Let's try to keep this conversation productive by avoiding Ad hominem attacks so please stop calling other members trolls or telling them to STFU.

      Also, let's avoid calls to have anyone locked up.
      posted by loup (staff) at 9:27 AM on October 2 [5 favorites]


      Thanks for the mod note, loup.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 9:32 AM on October 2 [3 favorites]


      At this point, the only thing that is going to turn the screws is an extremely large scale, extended and distributed, leaderless refusal to put money into the system. We need to use our collective ability to cause the rich, excruciating, economic pain, and to frighten them in the process.

      This. We saw how quickly a boycott of Disney had an effect. It's time for the resistance to realize that all corporations are part of the problem, and massive boycotts and strikes are the one power left to the masses.
      Imagine the reaction to a truly dismal holiday season, organized as an economic strike against the regime, followed by strikes through the winter and spring.
      posted by OHenryPacey at 9:35 AM on October 2 [6 favorites]


      Stepping back a bit, the one thing I think everyone here is asking is "What can I do?"

      My suggestion, for now, is to spread the news. Tell everyone you know that this, federal agents ransacking whole apartment buildings without warrants and hauling away children in box trucks in the night, is happening. Tell your allies. Tell your conservative relatives. Everyone.

      Make it an event that can't be ignored. That's what a regular person like you can do. For now.
      posted by neuracnu at 9:35 AM on October 2 [19 favorites]


      It's going to be very interesting in the context of a government shutdown to see how these ICE soldiers keep up the bad fight without any fucking pay.

      Do we have any reason to believe they aren't getting paid? This administration just does what it wants; if it wants "shutdown" to mean "except that we disburse funds to ICE immediately and without interruption" then it will.
      posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 9:39 AM on October 2 [7 favorites]


      Which is why our governor says, film them. Safely try to film them and politely ask for names and badge numbers. A lot of this is done in the dark, document this, even as we cannot stop it. It's made a difference in many instances in the past. At the very least might help produce more national outcry.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 9:40 AM on October 2 [9 favorites]


      Pretty sure this administration would be entirely comfortable using the shutdown carveouts for federal law enforcement to keep paying ICE. Given who they are and how they operate, honestly it would be wild to think they wouldn't.
      posted by DirtyOldTown at 9:46 AM on October 2


      I live in Puerto Rico. My son and I intend to visit the States (New Mexico and California) and relatives over Christmas. My son is 18 and looks very Latino. Being raised in Puerto Rico, he speaks English with an accent. I am frightened that he will be pulled over and detained by ICE. I figure he can carry his birth certificate (natural born citizen) but it doesn't have a photo. He doesn't have a driver's license yet (but will soon). I am worried about him carrying a passport everywhere.

      And I don't believe evidence is enough. And I truly wonder what I will do if they try to detain him or worse in front of me. (I am half-Hispanic but look white) It is illegal to be brown in America.
      posted by dances_with_sneetches at 9:47 AM on October 2 [17 favorites]


      Which is why our governor says, film them. Safely try to film them and politely ask for names and badge numbers. A lot of this is done in the dark, document this, even as we cannot stop it. It's made a difference in many instances in the past. At the very least might help produce more national outcry.

      I think I've noted this on the blue before, but this shit does work. A few weeks ago a team of these loser-ass losers was bumbling around a large courtyard building at the end of my block. I was walking back from the Dunkin as they assembled, and so I just plopped myself down on the curb with my phone out. A couple other nosy-ass middle aged ladies came out onto their porches as well. One of the guys looked over my way and I was like "listen I got an extra large iced coffee and no interest in going back to work, I could be here alllllllll day."

      They bumbled around for a few more minutes, knocked on no doors, then got in their unmarked SUVs and drove away.

      Chicago: I know you, you are FULL of nosy-ass middle-aged bitches like me who love having eyes on their blocks. We need everyone out on the porches, making these fascist losers feel like the abject dinguses they are.
      posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 9:56 AM on October 2 [54 favorites]


      My son and I intend to visit the States (New Mexico and California) and relatives over Christmas

      Jesus Christ, don't. Anyone who loves you will forgive you in these circumstances or even decamp to Puerto Rico to visit instead.
      posted by Shepherd at 9:59 AM on October 2 [31 favorites]


      The jurisdictions under siege need to be using this as an opportunity to purge their own police of disloyal elements.

      Run building inspections on every facility housing, feeding, and supporting ICE officers. Send a rotating staff of state/city police escorts with your building inspectors. If ICE doesn¡¯t let them in, blockade the building. If the cops let themselves be turned around by feds, fire them.

      Mayors and governors should not authorize ¡°hot¡± confrontations. They should set up confrontations that expose weaknesses in their own authority and create emergency-docket cases over federal authority.
      posted by Headfullofair at 10:02 AM on October 2 [8 favorites]


      This kind of thing is great. They were using UHaul and Budget trucks to transport people, so boycott UHaul and Budget please.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 10:04 AM on October 2 [8 favorites]


      .
      posted by Going To Maine at 10:10 AM on October 2


      The government is the terrorists now.
      posted by tommasz at 10:12 AM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      The UHaul and Budget comment sections on Instagram are full of complaints love to see it keep all that up AGITATE
      posted by tiny frying pan at 10:13 AM on October 2 [10 favorites]


      Some detail from a reporter on the ground via BlueSky.
      posted by DirtyOldTown at 10:13 AM on October 2 [4 favorites]


      Meanwhile in Los Angeles:

      Immigration activists in LA launch 'Liberty Vans' to respond to ICE raids (ABC7)
      The Liberty Vans aren't expected to stop the raids, but the goal is to make sure federal agents comply with the law. The vehicles will be staffed with three people to assist immigrants.

      "The faith leader is going to, obviously, provide spiritual support. The lawyer will provide on-site legal assistance, and the videographer is going to document what happens," Gutierrez said.

      "We know right now it is a very difficult time to ask for help. Sometimes people feel that because the federal government has been targeting them, that going anywhere near government assistance is going to put them at risk," said L.A. County Supervisor Lindsey Horvath. "Let people know they're not alone. There are organizations here to support you."

      In the city of San Fernando on Friday, Horvath and the city announced a $95,000 grant to support immigrant families. This will expand food distributions, emergency cash and case management to those impacted by ICE raids.
      posted by rambling wanderlust at 10:15 AM on October 2 [15 favorites]


      Not for nothing, it's debatable how real of a presence that the Tren de Aragua gang even is at this point and invoking them is often a pretext for deporting Venezuelans.
      posted by DirtyOldTown at 10:21 AM on October 2 [11 favorites]


      it's debatable how real of a presence that the Tren de Aragua gang even is at this point and invoking them is often a pretext for deporting Venezuelans.

      I am Jill's Total Lack Of Surprise.
      posted by EmpressCallipygos at 10:26 AM on October 2 [8 favorites]


      > What the fuck do you think the governor can do?

      1. Start mass vetting state and local police. Fire those who fail to support the individual rights of citizens, think that using the military to impose law on the US is acceptable, etc. Replace with those who do.

      2. Deploy police to do ID checks on all purported federal agents and out of state military. Extensively check that every single federal agent and military member is a legal member of the federal agency and military. Prosecute and arrest those who refuse to comply with such checks as failing to obey a lawful police order. Do this everywhere. When verified, record the information publicly (person X that looks like Y is federal agent of agency Z at location W) for public safety reasons (so people can check who is actually a law enforcement officer and who is not) and move on.

      3. Ban landing of aircraft, etc, outside of airports even for law enforcement purposes. Ban urban use of heavy trucks even for law enforcement purposes except on specific arteries as a traffic safety measure. Pass laws making wearing body armor illegal without a permit from state authorities.

      4. Call up the national guard. Have them film federal units and document all constitutional violations. Have them rotate regularly, and check the identity and documentation of every federal unit they interact with. Fly the state flag with each such unit. Get the state national guard patriotic for the State and its Citizens, and show the flag.

      5. Announce publicly that self-defence on masked, armed, armored and unbadged police is a legal use of self defence in the state.

      6. Detangle the State from the federal government, except when you can get between the individual and the federal government. (See if you can make people pay taxes through State controlled entities instead of directly to the Feds, for example.)
      posted by NotAYakk at 10:29 AM on October 2 [11 favorites]


      It seems the owner of this building was a notorious slumord and the building was riddled with broken windows and maintenance issues. The bit from the first article about how "Property managers were seen throwing mattresses and broken doors into dumpsters" makes them sound pretty callous about this.

      I hate the idea that slumlords are just exploiting immigrants and then figuring they'll just call ICE if some tenant is getting mouthy about wanting their windows fixed.
      posted by DirtyOldTown at 10:30 AM on October 2 [12 favorites]


      1. Start mass vetting state and local police.

      We have enough problems in Chicago's police force, our mayor and governor are well aware, and don't want to make more enemies there when they already aren't assisting ICE to any large degree, mostly because they are lazy and cowards.

      2. Deploy police to do ID checks on all purported federal agents and out of state military.

      Again, Chicago police won't assist with this.

      3. Ban landing of aircraft, etc, outside of airports even for law enforcement purposes. Ban urban use of heavy trucks even for law enforcement purposes except on specific arteries as a traffic safety measure. Pass laws making wearing body armor illegal without a permit from state authorities.

      I see lots of problems getting any of that through State legislature.

      4. Call up the national guard. Have them film federal units and document all constitutional violations.

      Um, the national guard is some of what Chicago is currently being threatened with? They would assist feds, not be against them.

      5. Announce publicly that self-defence on masked, armed, armored and unbadged police is a legal use of self defence in the state.

      That's the start of civil war, I fear.

      6. Detangle the State from the federal government, except when you can get between the individual and the federal government.

      Long game. We need work now, not down the road.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 10:37 AM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      I hate the idea that slumlords are just exploiting immigrants and then figuring they'll just call ICE if some tenant is getting mouthy about wanting their windows fixed.

      but how fucking 2025 is that
      posted by Didymus at 10:37 AM on October 2 [5 favorites]


      Gage Park Latinx Council just put out a warning that ICE is at the super mall at 51st and Kedzie. This is just across the street from me. Heading outside...
      posted by phunniemee at 10:50 AM on October 2 [17 favorites]


      > It is illegal to be brown in America.

      Bad Bunny could see ICE at Super Bowl show, Trump official suggests - "The Trump administration has been accused of racial profiling, in some instances, allegedly targeting Latino citizens in ICE raids. Far-right commentators erupted in fury at the news that the 2026 Super Bowl halftime show headliner would be Bad Bunny, who has become an increasingly political talking point after saying he would skip U.S. tour dates over ICE raid concerns... ICE is facing a number of lawsuits for allegedly illegally detaining Mexican Americans."

      from the comments in the nytimes' coverage: "There is an astounding article in the Sun Times with the head of US Border Patrol Greg Bovino telling a white reporter that they are going after people who 'don't look like him.' Then, apparently, demonstrating the principal in real time. It must be read to be believed."

      Transcript: Gregory Bovino says arrestees in Downtown Chicago chosen based partly on 'how they look'
      Editors¡¯ note: A few minutes before this interview, Sun-Times photographer Ashlee Rezin witnessed Bovino¡¯s team pursue a passerby. The man was shorter than the agents, barely reaching their shoulders, and had black hair, a pencil mustache, a goatee and brown skin. ¡°We got a runner,¡± Bovino yelled. The commander joined the agents in a sprint down the street. The chase ended with the man¡¯s detention.

      [...]

      Mitchell: How can you tell by appearance?

      Bovino: You know, there¡¯s many different factors that go into something like that. It would be agent experience, intelligence that indicates there¡¯s illegal alienage in a particular place or location. Then obviously the particular characteristics of an individual, how they look. How do they look compared to, say, you? What¡¯s your name again?

      Mitchell: Chip.

      Bovino: Chip? Hey, Chip, you or other folks. How do they appear in relation to what you or other people look like? So, a lot of different things that go into that, and then you¡¯ve also got that agent experience and knowledge.

      Mitchell: This particular guy.

      Bovino: What¡¯s that?

      Mitchell: This particular guy, what were the factors?

      Bovino: You know, I¡¯ll get into that. That¡¯s still an ongoing federal investigation, so I¡¯ll get back with you on exactly what that is once we determine all those facts.
      more local coverage...
      -Five anti-ICE protesters face federal charges
      -Chase of cyclist by ICE agents in downtown Chicago described as surreal by witness
      -Massive immigration raid on Chicago apartment building leaves residents reeling: 'I feel defeated'
      -Mother, children detained by ICE at Millennium Park Sunday held at O'Hare with other families: 'We never imagined'
      -Mother and children detained in Millennium Park released from ICE custody, father flown to Texas detention center: 'We're praying for a miracle'
      -Lake County school officials helping parents with ICE fears: 'We have seen ¡­ uncertainty, urgency and confusion'

      also btw...
      -Restorative Justice and Libertarianism
      -Pope Leo criticizes 'inhuman' treatment of immigrants in US
      -Pope Leo's critique of Trump ends honeymoon with conservative Catholics
      -Trump tells Congress he has decided the US is at war with cartels[*]
      posted by kliuless at 10:56 AM on October 2 [16 favorites]


      Their not only Tren de Aragua, they're 150 years old and collecting Social Security and eating dogs.
      posted by dances_with_sneetches at 10:57 AM on October 2 [5 favorites]


      False alarm maybe thank goodness?Everything looked completely unremarkable/business as usual. Only vehicle out of place was the CPS inter school exchange van and I think he was just eating lunch.

      We live in really stupid times.
      posted by phunniemee at 11:01 AM on October 2 [5 favorites]


      ICE is still getting paid and still terrorizing the general public, but we can't go to a national park, how the fuck does that make sense and who wrote the rules so that during a "government shutown" only the shit we care about is stopped while every one of the Republican parts of government is operating at what looks like full capicity and without any problems?

      "Law enforcement" has always been exempt from shutdowns, yeah. Dems can't exactly demand that Our Boys In Blue get sent home too without the obvious political blowback so this is traditional.
      posted by BungaDunga at 11:03 AM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      Pope Leo's critique of Trump ends honeymoon with conservative Catholics

      Trump said he wanted to be the pope, and now he functionally is, at least for conservative Catholics.
      posted by jedicus at 11:03 AM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      We live in really stupid times.

      The stupidest. We had a thankfully false alarm as well at our Cermak Market yesterday; I stg if they fuck with my Cermak...
      posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 11:04 AM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      (as a practical matter, these days it's Russ Vought who decides)
      posted by BungaDunga at 11:06 AM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      If Chicago PD ¡°will not do¡± ID checks on ICE officers, and therefore city leaders refuse to ask, leadership has capitulated to the police state.

      City leaders have allowed police to coalesce into independent powers by refusing to test civilian control with contentious orders.

      Right now is a unique opportunity to issue such contentious orders and reassert civilian control.
      posted by Headfullofair at 11:10 AM on October 2 [8 favorites]


      I hate the idea that slumlords are just exploiting immigrants and then figuring they'll just call ICE if some tenant is getting mouthy about wanting their windows fixed.

      I'm sure there are slumlords doing exactly that, but a building like this was part of a loan portfolio (Joe Engleman/Bsky). The problem goes back to a PE-backed asset manager that took over the portfolio, K Star (owned by KKR).

      It makes me feel like a crazy conspiracy theorist, but do K Star and KKR benefit from this ICE raid? Are they closer to profit by clearing out tenants through fear and abduction? What about the other two properties now owned by the same special servicer?
      posted by gladly at 11:10 AM on October 2 [3 favorites]


      Oh okay and I've just seen this.

      They're driving vehicles with the Mexican flag on them to blend in. Cool. Nice. Really great. Not surprising I guess.
      posted by phunniemee at 11:10 AM on October 2 [4 favorites]


      Headfullofair: "If Chicago PD ¡°will not do¡± ID checks on ICE officers, and therefore city leaders refuse to ask, leadership has capitulated to the police state.
      "

      I don't know how you make local police interfere with feds, I just don't. Do you?
      posted by tiny frying pan at 11:12 AM on October 2 [2 favorites]


      I am sincerely not trying to argue or fight in this thread, only sharing my perspective as someone who has lived in Chicago over 24 years and locally my whole life. There is no "one simple trick" here and we all know it would be great if there was.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 11:16 AM on October 2 [7 favorites]


      That link gladly posted is interesting for a lot of reasons, but the thing I got stuck on was that the building in question apparently has 130 units.

      Even if you're conservative estimating occupancy, number of tenants per unit, and number of people home at the time, you'd have to say there were... 150 people home? And they had 37 actual immigration policy violators to show for it? So like 75% of the people they rounded up and sacred the shit out of were legal residents/citizens?

      Jesus Christ.
      posted by DirtyOldTown at 11:17 AM on October 2 [9 favorites]


      Not just that, but damaged the building further and made it less secure for legal residents.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 11:20 AM on October 2 [4 favorites]


      I would really like to know if they bothered to get a warrant for each and every unit they smashed their way into. Sure, racial stops have been sanctioned by SCOTUS but they haven't actually condoned warrantless raids yet.
      posted by BungaDunga at 11:26 AM on October 2 [4 favorites]


      There are many, many reports of no warrants shown here during raids. So who knows if they have them or not. Nothing matters, apparently.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 11:27 AM on October 2 [9 favorites]


      Like I'm 99% sure you can't get a warrant for an entire apartment building. You need a warrant for each unit and who you're trying to arrest in each one. Yes, they can get away with scooping up anyone they happen to come across, but SCOTUS hasn't actually bent the fourth amendment this much yet.
      posted by BungaDunga at 11:28 AM on October 2 [4 favorites]


      elizabot mentioned Portland: I saw a claim (I think on Reddit) that Portland has various restrictions on ICE facilities and has threatened to shut them down for violations. I don't know if that's true, but I would not be surprised if jedicus's suggestions resulted in the appearance of federal troops, similar to what's happening in Portland.

      so I did a quick search:


      City of Portland will issue land use violation notice for ICE facility, triggering process to determine next steps at the site - Portland.gov press release

      Portland threatens to evict Ice from Oregon facility over permit violations, The Guardian, Street Roots reporter Jeremiah Hayden *

      Portland says ICE violated agreement with city 25 times by holding detainees too long - Oregon Public Broadcasting

      So if you're in a city that's been targeted, it might be worth calling your local city council persons and your local district attorney, and if you're in a state that's been targeted, it might be worth calling your state attorney general's office as well as the governor's office:
      * thank them for anything you're aware of that they've done to push back
      * ask them what else they plan to do and stress the urgency
      * tell them you strongly support pushing back against illegal and violent incursions into your state


      * Huh. It looks like Street Roots reporter Jeremiah Hayden writes for a local free street newspaper in Portland, and apparently the Guardian credited him and that paper? That seems pretty cool. Hayden has a followup at Street Roots: Portland officials threaten to fine landlord over ICE actions
      posted by kristi at 11:29 AM on October 2 [13 favorites]


      I don't know how you make local police interfere with feds, I just don't. Do you?

      City mayors can barely force cops to enforce traffic laws. When cities try to fire cops for cause they end up sued by the union and forced to pay out damages and/or reinstate them.
      posted by BungaDunga at 11:35 AM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      Chicago area Mefite meetup at the Broadview ICE facility? What if everyone in the Chicagoland area made the neighborhoods around the ICE facility as crowded as downtown at rush hour?

      I¡¯m not super interested in a violent repressive melee thanks
      posted by sickos haha yes dot jpg at 11:38 AM on October 2


      > (as a practical matter, these days it's Russ Vought who decides)

      Trump, Vought to decide which "Democrat Agencies" to cut during shutdown "opportunity" - "The president doesn't have the authority to unilaterally eliminate agencies created by Congress."

      What to know about Russ Vought, the shutdown's quiet power broker - "In the Trump White House, Vought stands out for knowing how the bureaucracy works and how to navigate it."[1,2]

      > I don't know how you make local police interfere with feds, I just don't. Do you?

      Can California state officials now arrest ICE officers who refuse to obey the law of remaining unmasked when performing their 'duties'? "No."

      also btw... posted by kliuless at 11:42 AM on October 2 [8 favorites]


      I don't think you can make local police act against the feds, and if you could, all the feds would have to do is not comply with the police. Then you're right back to "who's got more violence at their disposal". Remember: you're dealing with groups already ignoring the law. There's no "arrest and prosecute" available right now.

      I can think of only three avenues to fight back. Economic, popular support, and logistically. I know we can't starve out the money train going to ice. But we can stop transacting with them. Don't sell them gasoline. Or sandwiches. Or bottled water. Evict them where possible. Don't rent hotel rooms to them. Boycott any businesses that do do any business with them. Can the city shut off power and water to their buildings? Make them cart supplies in, constantly. Make them run generators to keep the lights on and eat MRE'S day in and day out. Make them run their own communications systems, boycott any isp's or cell companies that contract with ice. If they're going to insist on being an occupying army, do whatever you can, however small, to make them work for it.

      Violence won't work here. Keep up every effort to identify and ostracize them, and anyone involved with, or supporting them. Keep up the surveillance on them, film every interaction you can.

      I know these aren't easy ideas to pull off, but nothing about this situation is easy.
      posted by Seven Hundred Angry Bees at 11:45 AM on October 2 [7 favorites]


      tiny frying pan: Which is why our governor says, film them. Safely try to film them and politely ask for names and badge numbers. A lot of this is done in the dark, document this, even as we cannot stop it. It's made a difference in many instances in the past. At the very least might help produce more national outcry.

      And California has passed legislation prohibiting ICE agents from wearing masks:

      California passes law banning ICE agents from wearing masks to hide their identities, NPR, Gerardo Zavala

      While that may get thrown out by the courts, it's worth trying everything. It's worth passing the legislation; it's worth making it clear that masked thugs are not welcome and are violating the will of the people.

      From (Reagan-appointed, not that it's supposed to matter) Judge Bill Young's blistering ruling against Trump, Rubio, and Noem yesterday:
      ICE goes masked for a single reason¡ªto terrorize Americans into quiescence. Small wonder ICE often seems to need our respected military to guard them as they go about implementing our immigration laws. It should be noted that our troops do not ordinarily wear masks. Can you imagine a masked marine? It is a matter of honor¡ªand honor still matters. To us, masks are associated with cowardly desperados and the despised Ku Klux Klan. In all our history we have never tolerated an armed masked secret police. Carrying on in this fashion, ICE brings indelible obloquy to this administration and everyone who works in it.
      (The fine folks at Electoral-Vote.com have summarized and excerpted the ruling, but the whole thing is worth reading.)

      For me, it's really important to note that many, many people, including Republican-appointed federal judges, strongly oppose so much of what this administration is doing. It's helpful to me to know that support for immigrants among the public is growing.

      Shining a light on the crimes and brutality makes a difference.
      posted by kristi at 11:46 AM on October 2 [12 favorites]


      >>Chicago area Mefite meetup at the Broadview ICE facility? What if everyone in the Chicagoland area made the neighborhoods around the ICE facility as crowded as downtown at rush hour?

      >>I¡¯m not super interested in a violent repressive melee thanks


      you may want to sit down for what I'm about to tell you
      posted by Didymus at 11:47 AM on October 2 [4 favorites]


      But we can stop transacting with them. Don't sell them gasoline. Or sandwiches. Or bottled water. If they're going to insist on being an occupying army, do whatever you can, however small, to make them work for it.

      The way you make an anti-insurgency occupying army "work for it" is armed insurgency. Iraq and Afghanistan made us work for it. Vietnam made us work for it, and not by denying customer service to a government that will prosecute you for refusing to print Charlie Kirk flyers.
      posted by aintnolobos at 11:55 AM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      Meanwhile in Portland...

      ¡®War-ravaged¡¯ Portland hits back on Trump ¡ª with crochet, chicken costumes and farmers markets (LA Times)
      Oregon officials have pushed back forcefully, flooding their own social media with images of colorful cafe tables, sun-drenched farmers markets, rose gardens in full bloom and parks bursting with children, families and frolicking dogs. Officials would prefer the city be known for its Portlandia vibe, and are begging residents to stay peaceful and not give the Trump administration a protest spectacle.

      ¡°There is no need or legal justification for military troops,¡± Oregon Gov. Tina Kotek has said, over and over again, on her Instagram and in texts to President Trump that have been released publicly. Officials have gone to court seeking an order to stop the deployment, with a hearing set for Friday.
      ¡®Emergency¡¯ World Naked Bike Ride planned in Portland (Oregon Live)
      The world has seen a lot from Portland lately. It may be about to see a lot more.

      Organizers of the World Naked Bike Ride said on Instagram Wednesday that they¡¯re planning to protest the Trump administration¡¯s decision to send 200 federalized National Guard troops to Portland.

      ¡°Emergency World Naked Bike Ride coming up in response to the militarization of our city,¡± reads the caption of an Instagram reel posted by the event¡¯s organizers. ¡°Plans are being worked on.¡±
      posted by rambling wanderlust at 11:59 AM on October 2 [7 favorites]


      The way you make an anti-insurgency occupying army "work for it" is armed insurgency. Iraq and Afghanistan made us work for it. Vietnam made us work for it, and not by denying customer service to a government

      A lot of resistance members from various European nations during WWII would like a stern word with you.
      posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 11:59 AM on October 2 [9 favorites]


      A lot of resistance members from various European nations during WWII would like a stern word with you.

      Thank God European resistance movements ended the occupations by refusing to sell the nazis coffee and sandwiches. If they hadn't thought of that first they might have ended up doing something rash.
      posted by aintnolobos at 12:05 PM on October 2 [2 favorites]


      Thank God a snarky comment on MeFi ended the occupations by quashing any notion of small acts of resistance.
      posted by mazola at 12:19 PM on October 2 [14 favorites]


      You're right they might have it's too bad they never did because those all would absolutely have worked.

      Instead they wasted their time getting people false papers, feeding those in hiding, botching paperwork and delaying operations, smuggling people out of countries/cities, which definitely was pointless and never helped anyone.
      posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 12:23 PM on October 2 [13 favorites]


      Anyway since you clearly have several national allied armies at hand to wage full world war (the only thing that actually worked) against the United States I'll just await their arrival!
      posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 12:24 PM on October 2 [3 favorites]


      Some people love the idea of blood in the streets, and yet they always seem to be volunteering someone else's bodily fluids for the splash.
      posted by tclark at 12:25 PM on October 2 [5 favorites]


      Crystal night Chicago
      posted by hortense at 12:28 PM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      Immigration activists in LA launch 'Liberty Vans' to respond to ICE raids [ABC7]
      posted by mazola at 12:32 PM on October 2 [2 favorites]


      Citro?n Sabotaged Wartime Nazi Truck Production In A Simple And Brilliant Way (Jalopnik)
      So, when France was occupied by the Germans in 1940, major French factories like Citro?n were forced to produce equipment for the Nazis. Citro?n president Pierre-Jules Boulanger knew he couldn't just refuse to produce anything, but he also knew there's no way in hell he's going to just roll over and build trucks for a bunch of filthy Nazis. Pierre had a plan.

      John Reynold's book Citro?n 2CV describes Boulanger's sabotage efforts. Of course, he instructed workers to set a nice, leisurely pace when building trucks (likely Citro?n T45 trucks) for the Wermacht, but that's fairly obvious. What was brilliant was Boulanger's idea to move the little notch on the trucks' oil dipsticks that indicated the proper level of oil down just a bit lower.

      By moving the notch down, the trucks would not have enough oil, but German mechanics would have no idea, because, hey, the little notch on the dipstick says its just fine. Then, after the truck has been used for a while and is out deployed somewhere crucial, whammo, the engine seizes up, and you've got a lot of angry, stranded, vulnerable Nazis, balling up their little fists and redly barking curses in German.
      posted by rambling wanderlust at 12:35 PM on October 2 [20 favorites]


      the sheriff of Cook county could deputize like half of Chicago if the board authorizes it.
      posted by clavdivs at 1:25 PM on October 2 [2 favorites]


      How is this not national news? ICE is stacking naked children in UHauls like cordwood and it doesn't make the front page of the NYT? This is such a disorienting time to be a person.
      posted by prefpara at 1:28 PM on October 2 [10 favorites]


      what is happening in Chicago does not fit The Narrative
      posted by Didymus at 1:33 PM on October 2


      How is this not national news? ICE is stacking naked children in UHauls like cordwood and it doesn't make the front page of the NYT?

      I share your disgust about what's happening, but I'm genuinely not sure why you are surprised the New York Times isn't carrying a news item from Chicago on its front page, when a couple of larger nationwide events are also happening simultaneously?

      But it is on a few front pages elsewhere.
      posted by EmpressCallipygos at 1:33 PM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      Because the "national media" are owned by right-wing billionaires:

      Bari Weiss to lead CBS News as part of major Paramount Skydance shakeup: sources (NY Post link sorry)
      posted by BungaDunga at 1:34 PM on October 2 [5 favorites]


      I'm genuinely not sure why you are surprised the New York Times isn't carrying a news item from Chicago on its front page

      The New York "Paper of Record" Times routinely covers local stories with fewer national hooks than this, including right now "Des Moines Schools Superintendent Arrested by ICE Faces New Gun Charge"
      posted by BungaDunga at 1:36 PM on October 2 [3 favorites]


      (the gun charge is "owning a gun while not having the right papers"- I guess the second amendment just turns off when your visa runs out)
      posted by BungaDunga at 1:41 PM on October 2 [2 favorites]


      Bungadunga, the question was about whether said article was front page. The Des Moines Superintendent piece isn't front page either.
      posted by EmpressCallipygos at 1:41 PM on October 2


      That Des Moines story is on the top of the Times website right now, right under the top headline. This Chicago raid isn't even "below the fold" on the front page. I'm not sure if it's even been written up anywhere on the NYT website. They found room for "A Tile-Filled Home Where the Bathroom Is a Social Hub. In Guadalajara, Mexico, a couple pay tribute to the ceramics that drew them there" though.
      posted by BungaDunga at 1:45 PM on October 2 [2 favorites]


      And that Des Moines story is written by a Chicago-based national correspondent, so they might even have actual physical NYT reporters that could go over there and have a look.
      posted by BungaDunga at 1:46 PM on October 2


      The Times has to be fair reporters in Chicago writing about this : Drones, Helicopters, Hundreds of Arrests: Trump¡¯s Immigration Crackdown in Chicago So Far, from yesterday.
      posted by BungaDunga at 1:50 PM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      tiny frying pan¡ª in practical terms, I absolutely agree with you¡ªIt would be extremely difficult to force local cops or state police to comply with a mayor/governor¡¯s order in opposition to the feds. Trying to do so sets up a very difficult test of the mayor¡¯s/governor¡¯s power.

      But¡ªif you can¡¯t force civilian control of the police to accomplish something with overwhelming popular support¡ªthen it can¡¯t happen at all.

      Are democratic leaders willing to use a crisis to turn statutory power into real power? This is an important question, and making a policy proposal that local police should, at minimum, engage in malicious compliance with ICE, reveals the actual commitments of local politicians.
      posted by Headfullofair at 1:50 PM on October 2


      Okay, that raises an interesting point - how exactly are we defining "front page"? Because we may just have a semantic thing happening. I'm talking about the physical front page of the physical paper that was released this morning, as opposed to what is on the web page as of 4:45 pm EST today.

      Also, doesn't the placement of the articles on the web page change a lot through a given day?
      posted by EmpressCallipygos at 1:51 PM on October 2


      But¡ªif you can¡¯t force civilian control of the police to accomplish something with overwhelming popular support¡ªthen it can¡¯t happen at all.

      After seeing how the eg NYPD behaved during BLM protests, no, I don't think this can happen at all.
      posted by BungaDunga at 1:52 PM on October 2


      BungaDinga¡ª should we stop proposing civilian control of police just because it is unlikely? That seems very defeatist.
      posted by Headfullofair at 1:56 PM on October 2


      front page and top story are two different things as we all know. a benchmark for the top story of the day is usually what is run first on the Big Three orchestral nightly news.
      posted by clavdivs at 2:00 PM on October 2


      I think establishing functional elected control of the police in cities like NY would be a generational project. We should do it, but it's not happening soon.
      posted by BungaDunga at 2:00 PM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      simply bypass that and use the sheriff system which is not subject to Federal direction only state law.
      posted by clavdivs at 2:03 PM on October 2


      Of course, DHS apparently posted a sizzle reel about this raid (BlueSky link).
      posted by carrienation at 2:04 PM on October 2


      Headfullofair: "in practical terms, I absolutely agree with you¡ªIt would be extremely difficult to force local cops or state police to comply with a mayor/governor¡¯s order in opposition to the feds. Trying to do so sets up a very difficult test of the mayor¡¯s/governor¡¯s power.

      But¡ªif you can¡¯t force civilian control of the police to accomplish something with overwhelming popular support¡ªthen it can¡¯t happen at all.

      Are democratic leaders willing to use a crisis to turn statutory power into real power? This is an important question, and making a policy proposal that local police should, at minimum, engage in malicious compliance with ICE, reveals the actual commitments of local politicians.
      "

      I guess I don't really get what you're getting at, except disappointment in leaders who can't do a thing that would be cool but can't be done. Practically. Like, actually done, on the ground done. I wish for things too.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 2:05 PM on October 2


      simply bypass that and use the sheriff system which is not subject to Federal direction only state law.

      So are cops, in theory. That doesn't seem to stop them from voluntarily working with them, even against state or local law.
      posted by BungaDunga at 2:05 PM on October 2


      Also what's with the defense of the NYT on this site? Still? They're a disgusting paper that helped elect Trump. And are helping him still. It's not surprising they don't give a shit about Chicago.
      posted by tiny frying pan at 2:06 PM on October 2 [8 favorites]


      Generational projects involve divisive policy proposals that, while unadopted, create political fissures necessary to build support for the generational project.
      posted by Headfullofair at 2:06 PM on October 2


      It is illegal to be brown in America.

      Full stop. None of this is, or was ever, about stopping crime. It's about terrorizing communities of color.
      posted by Rykey at 2:07 PM on October 2 [5 favorites]


      the LASD is filled with actual gangs. yes, this is theoretically fixable, but it's been a problem for decades.
      posted by BungaDunga at 2:10 PM on October 2 [2 favorites]


      How the 1968 DNC in Chicago Devolved into ¡®Unrestrained and Indiscriminate Police Violence¡¯

      Gregory v. City of Chicago, 394 U.S. 111 (1969)


      So are cops, in theory
      No in fact the local police answer to the mayor or whatever governing body, sheriff answers to no one other than the people that elected them.
      posted by clavdivs at 2:23 PM on October 2


      Can we keep the defeatist posts about our inability to reign in bad cops on topic? This is a thread about Chicago. Bring up Homan Square or something.
      posted by Headfullofair at 2:27 PM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      use the sheriff system
      sheriff answers to no one other than the people that elected them.

      Um. Which in practice often means that the sheriff - being a county-level office - is answering to the suburban, exurban, and maybe even rural white petty bourgeoisie that control county level power and dominate county elections.

      MAGATs, in other words. Y'know, the car dealers and franchise owners and real estate speculators that are all in on Trump.

      I'm perfectly happy making the wild generalization that county sheriff's departments are waaaaaay more likely to be waaaaaay more problematic than city cops.
      posted by soundguy99 at 2:35 PM on October 2 [2 favorites]


      Thank God European resistance movements ended the occupations by refusing to sell the nazis coffee and sandwiches. If they hadn't thought of that first they might have ended up doing something rash.

      My grandfather was part of the resistance in Hamburg. He and a friend worked with some contacts in the British Secret Service to try and distribute fake ration cards around northern Germany with the goal of messing up domestic supplly and logistics.
      posted by nickmark at 2:44 PM on October 2 [7 favorites]


      reminder: police are civilians.

      they themselves co-opted the term after 9/11, during first-responder worship - in order to other the groups they ostensibly protect and serve.
      posted by j_curiouser at 2:46 PM on October 2 [3 favorites]


      are you referring to sheriff dart as some sort of MAGA thing because that's woo.

      the sheriff system that you have successfully crafted into a cartoon is apt in a republican stronghold.
      posted by clavdivs at 2:50 PM on October 2


      It's going to be very interesting in the context of a government shutdown to see how these ICE soldiers keep up the bad fight without any fucking pay.

      Looking back in the thread a bit: yeah, they're going to keep getting paid, but I think it's more important that we understand that these guys have been hankering for this their whole lives. They'd have done it for free if they were allowed and now they're not only allowed but getting paid for it.

      If you catch yourself thinking about appealing to their better natures, you can save yourself the energy.
      posted by klanawa at 3:54 PM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      They'd have done it for free if they were allowed and now they're not only allowed but getting paid for it.

      Yeah, I don't think the part about dumping a ton of money into ICE under the BBB has kicked in yet, but when it does, boy howdy are things gonna get way uglier.
      posted by Rykey at 4:10 PM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      I am not supposed to be spending any more time on MetaFilter today but because I've been seeing conflicting reports in this thread about whether ICE will be paid during the shutdown - I poked around, and I'm seeing conflicting reports elsewhere too, but it LOOKS like they will NOT be paid during the shutdown, but will get back pay afterward.

      WLOS ABC 13 News:
      Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem said DHS officers will work through the "Democrats' shutdown" and that more than 200,000 of these officers will go without pay.

      The Democrats will be forcing over 150,000 officers and nearly 50,000 members of the military¡ªour frontline of defense¡ªto continue protecting our nation without pay," Noem said.

      While the officers will go without pay now, the Government Employee Fair Treatment Act of 2019 requires all essential or furloughed employees under the shutdown to be paid retroactively once it ends.
      AZ Central:
      The funding ICE and CBP receive from the One Big Beautiful Bill is separate from the annual appropriations the immigration agencies already receive, Reichlin-Melnick said in his analysis.

      Because of that funding, there may be key differences this year on how the government shutdown affects immigration agencies...
      So ... sounds like probably they won't be paid, although there's still money to hire and train, shutdown or no?

      There, now I'm barely more informed than I was before.
      posted by kristi at 4:15 PM on October 2 [1 favorite]


      I think the point somebody above was making is that, regardless of whether ICE isn't supposed to get paid during a shutdown, Trump could basically make it happen so that they are. Because nothing matters any more re: what's "supposed" to happen under "laws" or "norms" or whatever.
      posted by Rykey at 4:20 PM on October 2


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